Here’s some good news for you: Hamlet wasn’t contemplating nihilism. From my high school
English classes through to my university English literature classes, I’ve been told that Hamlet’s
famous soliloquy was about whether to commit suicide or not. However, the Prince of Denmark
was more concerned with the choice of being a scuzzy, disloyal subject who will bide his time until
he becomes king or of giving Claudius the old Right There Fred. By reading this soliloquy the way
the Bard intended, we can perhaps find the strength to fight the outrageous slings and arrows of
outrageous government ourselves.
Here are perhaps the most famous words ever written by Shakes:
HAMLET
To be, or not to be–that is the question:
Whether ’tis nobler in the mind to suffer
The slings and arrows of outrageous fortune
Or to take arms against a sea of troubles
And by opposing end them. To die, to sleep–
No more–and by a sleep to say we end
The heartache, and the thousand natural shocks
That flesh is heir to. ‘Tis a consummation
Devoutly to be wished. To die, to sleep–
To sleep–perchance to dream: ay, there’s the rub,
For in that sleep of death what dreams may come
When we have shuffled off this mortal coil,
Must give us pause. There’s the respect
That makes calamity of so long life.
For who would bear the whips and scorns of time,
Th’ oppressor’s wrong, the proud man’s contumely
The pangs of despised love, the law’s delay,
The insolence of office, and the spurns
That patient merit of th’ unworthy takes,
When he himself might his quietus make
With a bare bodkin? Who would fardels bear,
To grunt and sweat under a weary life,
But that the dread of something after death,
The undiscovered country, from whose bourn
No traveller returns, puzzles the will,
And makes us rather bear those ills we have
Than fly to others that we know not of?
Thus conscience does make cowards of us all,
And thus the native hue of resolution
Is sicklied o’er with the pale cast of thought,
And enterprise of great pitch and moment
With this regard their currents turn awry
And lose the name of action. — Soft you now,
The fair Ophelia! — Nymph, in thy orisons
Be all my sins remembered.
What I had been taught repeatedly by corduroy elbow patch wearing public school teachers was
that the To be is referring to existing, or, in other words, to live and the not to be is referring to
committing suicide. There’s just one problem with that interpretation: Hamlet had already
decided to kill Claudius before this scene. What he’s torn on here is the consequences of killing
the usurping sumbitch. If he is To be that means continuing the way things are and eventually
ending up as king one day himself. The other choice of not to be means he kills the king and, well,
hopefully, it’s a deep sleep when he dies because otherwise, he’ll be rotting in Hellsinki. Kill the
king and right Th’oppressor’s wrong and hope for the deep sleep. But damn, what if I’m wrong?
It’s a logical question that really doesn’t have anything to do with offing himself.
Let’s look at a couple of events from the past few years and see how the people involved may
have had similar thoughts to the young Hamlet.
Eduard Snowden
The lines from Hamlet that jumps out at me in relation to Snowden are:
The insolence of office, and the spurns
That patient merit of th’ unworthy takes,
The kid is living the high life in Hawaii, making six figures a year and he decides to chuck it all
in the shitter to expose massive 5th amendment violations by U.S. intelligence agencies.
Snowden must’ve had more than one sleepless night as he wrestled with the choice of exposing
The insolence of office by those tasked with keeping us safe. Did he contemplate suicide as a
solution to his problems? I highly doubt it and the reading of Hamlet contemplating action vs
inaction makes for an interesting comparison.
Sharyl Attkisson
Thus conscience does make cowards of us all,
An award-winning journalist for CBS News, Attkisson decided to leave CBS. She later explains how
her former employer had squelched stories on the Benghazi attacks and Obamacare. Like
Snowden, Attkisson did not fall victim to her inner coward and followed her conscience instead.
Did she pay a price? You can decide for yourself, but she paints a rather brutal picture of
corporate media in her book, Stonewalled: One Reporter’s Fight for Truth Against the Forces of
Obstruction, Intimidation, and Harassment in Obama’s Washington.
Ayaan Hirsi Ali
Whether ’tis nobler in the mind to suffer
The slings and arrows of outrageous fortune
Or to take arms against a sea of troubles
And by opposing end them.
Escaping from an arranged marriage and the threat of being the victim of an honor killing,
Hirsi Ali has certainly gone up against a sea of troubles over the years. Her choices were
blindly following the path expected of many Muslim women and accepting the domination
imposed on them by the men in their families or to break away and expose the reality of far too
many women in the Islamic world. Suicide? I’m sure her critics would love for that idea to be
floating around in her head. Instead, she took up arms in the form of exposing certain aspects
of older and even modern interpretations of Islam that are oppressive.
Of course, you are welcome to interpret young Hamlet’s soliloquy in whatever manner you like,
but I think you are missing out the debate going on in the prince’s head: Accept the fate that
has apparently been laid before you or attempt to right a wrong even though the law and even
God may not sanction your actions. How long do you wait when justice seems to have
abandoned your society and what happens if you have a society of vigilantes? I find these
questions rich for mining of philosophical discussions. Should you kill yourself or try to right a
wrong? Not much depth to that, unless you’re half a nihilist.
OT on the Republican shooting. What I’m curious to see is whether anyone on the left will own up to their own rhetoric that has encouraged violence. They love to push that narrative the other way, but are oddly silent when it comes to violence related to leftwing protests. Especially transparent over the last few years with Trump and BLM. Wherever there’s leftwing violence, there tends to be silence.
There’s leftists all over social media making asses of themselves. How many stories will CNN run on it (regardless of how newsworthy you consider it – that’s the sort of shit they do all the time the other way around)?
NO.
Here’s the order of events.
1. Twitter and FB outrage mobs claim this to be a heroic and totally justifiable event by the shooter.
2. Leftist media makes plea for common sense gun control, that would have totally prevented this
courageoustotally regrettable incident.3. Back to Trump and Russians.
These reports have an awfully high number of laughs and likes on Facebook. Awful.
Shows you what these people are really about…
I suppose when you tell yourself Republican approaches to health care and the environment really are killing people then you can justify anything.
Yup.. once you classify the enemy as murderous evil, then you can easily make excuses for violence against them…
They’ll run with whatever is convenient until the news cycle recycles again and then we are back to plain old TDS
Prediction: We will return to Russian fever dreams after lunch
“Oddly silent”
It’s not odd. They are craven liars.
I’ve been shit-posting a bunch of links on derpbook with comments about how the Democrats have to take responsibility for the results of their violent rhetoric to try to stir up the lefties, but so far it’s just crickets.
I prefer to get up and see the actress playing Queen Gertrude when Hamlet starts his soliloquy.
I have trouble with Attkisson because she’s a true anti-vaccine nutter.
I thought he was hilarious in Black Adder.
*narrows gaze*
*That’s supposed to say 4th amendment, but, oh well. It’s chock full of mistakes.
I blame…. well… you.
Good job Straff, I always had that bone to pick w/ academics as well. Took three years of Drama in HS, did a few secondary roles in some Shakespeare. It always struck me that there were reading the text out of context. You summarized the points pretty clearly and you examples are spot on. Thanks.
BTW, are you a bard fan in general or is this just a bone of contention you wanted to clarify?
Just have a memory of teachers explaining what they thought it was about before letting us read it. Then I reread it for the third time and the A or B is the question. A=gut it. B=fight it just became crystal clear. Who knows where that suicide thing came from When he himself might his quietus make / With a bare bodkin? line could be twisted to fit that, but it’s not convincing). I’m just going back over material I had read in my teens or twenties and finding how wrong I had been. Thanks, though.
I think the suicide piece came from academics own self-serving worldview. They were looking for meaning, saw an obvious one and decided to look deeper.
I think the compilation of suicide is too clear to ignore, but it is blown up to encompass the entire soliloquy and that’s a mistake.
2:30 am so I can’t go any longer, but that soliloquy how people see it reminds me of that trick art drawing of the old man/young lady. Once you see it one way, it’s the way you see it from then on. Maybe it was the intention.
+ 1 not
I thought the suicide angle was a lot stronger when he tells Ophelia to Get thee to a brook and drown yourself in it.
“Get thee to a Nunnery,
why wouldst thou be a breeder of sinners?”
A nunnery being both a place where women were supposed to be chaste and also a place to obtain an abortion in the popular Elizabethan imagination.
Also, I believe, period slang for a bordello.
That’s why all the abortions. Nunneries were thought to be whorehouses for priests, with popular opinion being that either the nuns were condemned to a rape camp or participating enthusiastically depending on which was the more useful story at the given time.
Everything Shakespeare wrote had multiple meanings. That was his genius. We don’t speak that form of the language well enough to follow all the meanings and often times there were additional local contexts that are missed or lost.
Because he was doing both things here is one of the reasons why the soliloquy is the most famous of his words. Getting the actor to understand and portray the duality is why it can be a career maker.
Alternative Discussion: “Merchant of Venice”, anti-semetic or an attempt to humanize (((them)))?
+1lb Flesh
Such a want-wit sadness makes of you. Your mind is tossing on the ocean.
there wouldn’t have been any (openly) practicing Jews in England during Shakespeare’s life, so possibly just ignorance?
It was a bit more than that.
English wariness of the Dutch and distrust of the Spanish and the French would have made the English petty gentry and merchant class look enviously at the sources of those rivals’ wealth. England was by comparison a poor nation, and inevitably, they’d look for reasons why their economy was at a disadvantage.
One very clear difference was the growth in Dutch mercantile power, brought by modern banking methods. Then there were the Spanish and Portuguese, becoming rich with their new conquests in the New World, which again, required modern financial instruments.
So Jews were doubly distrusted. Their actions were making England’s rivals powerful, and their beliefs were denounced by the Protestant clergy, who had a scapegoat for the martyrdom of Jesus.
It’s hard to imagine why any Jew would *want* to live openly in England, except for the obvious reasons. To the extent people in England were exposed to them, it was as foreign merchants or their representatives ‘ripping off’ the humble yet honest English artisans.
The Jew in England at the time filled the same niche as Bilderbergers now fill in the fevered leftist imagination.
The Illuminati Banker of Venice just doesn’t have the same ring to it.
Straffin the intellectual!
Nice job, man. I struggle with this one, though:
Isn’t it just the opposite? Doesn’t conscience kill the inner coward?
I think it depends in the action required. Inaction is easy, and easy to self-justify. A hard thing that our conscience demands may make a lesser man shirk from his moral duty.
See: Team Red Congresscritters.
This is the answer.
“A hard thing that our conscience demands may make a lesser man shirk from his moral duty.”
This. I have seen it. The courage often rises long after it is too late, after there is no fixing it. I have seen a man go insane from that.
Self-awareness, and fear of failure in the big moment makes men afraid
Ah, got it. Thanks to both of you.
Conscience would be just a little voice in his head telling him to take the easy path and not the conscience as we think of it today.
Make that thanks to all three of you.
That was my bad. I used the modern “conscience” in that sentence about Attkisson and made it confusing. Oops. Edit fairy can’t help that.
Nah, it’s just many years of head shots catching up to me. Thanks again for the essay.
Using “head shots” in a posting today? Consider me triggered.
Last thing, I promise! He’s afraid that he’d go to hell if he kills and so his conscience is paralyzing him. He violates his moral code in either case. Either Dad or Hamlet gets doomed. Tough spot. Off to bed.
Good stuff straffin.
More please.
I used to have the whole soliloquy memorized.
I found that memorizing it and saying it out loud over and over it’s a lot easier to understanding it than reading it
I had a drama teacher in high school who always used to say that moderns have trouble with Shakespeare because they first encounter him by reading his plays as if they’re novels. They’re scripts; they’re meant to be performed and seen/heard. His plays make the most sense when you actually see people acting out the roles and speaking the lines.
From personal experience, this…
OT: Y’know when you done forgot an italic tag and all the rest of the comments are in italics?
Well, somebody managed to mess up the entire front page the same way!
Whose head’s gotta roll for this?
Who knew they hired GILMORE on staff?
*i accomplished my acts of Mass-Font-Destruction @ Reason by copy-pasting Twitter quotes into their commenting system.
the thing that blew them up were those emoji icons that retards put in their handles.
I noticed the last time i glanced at Twitter that almost nobody has those things in their handles anymore.
oh, but here’s one. I will post it here and see what happens =
nothing. i am mildly disappointed.
Hmm, that actually may have been because Reason‘s commenting system seems to have been written by somebody who would’ve found “Unicode for dummies” hard to understand. The whole “emojis as text” thing is a fairly new addition to Unicode, and I wouldn’t be surprised if it had strange interactions with software whose attitude was “what is this ‘variable-length multibyte encoding’ you speak of?”
“Replying to @ShaunKing
Yes, let’s start with white men.”
Damn, I hope this was written with irony.
There’s no war on white men, you shitlord!
Shaun King’s going to be in trouble then…
Who gave Gilmore access?
I’m going to blame one of the girls.
“It’s a fair cop.”
Klaus: It’s a fair cop, but society’s to blame.
Detective: Agreed. We’ll be charging them too.
How can libertardians have a functioning society if they can’t even run a website?
The fact that we all congregate to a website and post civilly makes us fake libertarians.
I dont know why I keep doing this to myself. I sometimes pop over to TSTSNBN just to see…*facepalm* It is never going to end with them.
Sullum posted “Consumed by Pettiness” regarding Trump. That’s right, Donny Two-Scoops is consumed by pettiness.
That’s so ironic I can taste it.
Well, he kind of is. But! The media is on a die-hard quest to be even more petty than that.
It’s reminds me of jokes about gossip hounds. “Can you believe such and such would talk behind someone else’s back? How appalling! Oh, and by the way, did you hear about…”
I look at the magazine at work, haven’t been to the website since Glibs opened
Actually, I enjoyed that article. Sullum looks like a fool now that the Russia conspiracy has collapsed, so he’s clinging to anything. It’s pretty fun to watch him make a fool of himself
Much like Birther-ism, facts shall not get in the way of the Russian narrative.
I thought birtherism was hilarious, too. I like clowns on all sides
After the petulant freakout right after he came into power and the “Trump travel ban killed fake grandma” story that is the ultimate in throwing stones in a glasshouse.
Kos: Still a cunt
Kos? Kos…Kos….oh yeah. They are still around?
It’s like we’re living in 2005 all over again. Did you know that Haliburton made all this money off the invasion of Iraq? Oh well, I’m off to watch that new Ashton Kutcher movie. Better wear my trucker hat
Hey, did you hear that new Black Eyed Peas song?
I’m so 2008- you’re so 2000 and late
There’s an move called The Ninth Configuration which explores Hamlet’s sanity in an interesting way. It stars Stacey Keach as the new commanding officer of an Army looney bin. I won’t spoil it, but a major plot point is whether Hamlet goes insane or simply pretends to go insane to ward of actually going insane. Definitely worth renting.
“Twinkle Twinkle Killer Kane” was how I originally saw it. (internet says this movie was a different cut). Written and directed by the writer of “the Exorcist”.
Spoiler, it’s kinda like Shutter Island.
Kinda hard to sit thru, but worth the experience.
This would be a great one for our weekly grindhouse movie review.
And here I thought Danny Devito had the market cornered on Military/Hamlet movies.
Oh, and CBS News deleted a tweet with the McAuliffe “93 million” quote
In fairness to the lying piece of shit he simply mis-spoke in that case. I heard him say it this morning in an interview and he corrected himself.
Of course he did, just as Donald Trump doesn’t actually think that “covfefe” is a word. One gets hurriedly swept under the carpet, the other becomes fodder for dozens of headlines. They didn’t have to report it in the first place, but since they did, why delete rather than explain? Because they want to play Ministry of Truth instead and shelter a prominent Dem from laughs at his expense.
It’s a very minor thing, but emblematic of why most people have nothing but contempt for the media.
Trump sent Spicer out to announce that “covfefe” was not a typo and that “The president and a small group of people know exactly what he meant.”
That was hilarious. What kind of man is so petty that he will not admit when he’s misspelled something? God bless him.
Which was absolutely ludicrous, but wasn’t that after it already was a big story?
It was the next day. All I’m saying is that at least McAuliffe–as steamy a turd as there is–can at least admit to misspeaking. Donny sends out his dickpuppet to double down.
I agree.
Still doesn’t absolve CBS for covering for him, though.
I would have figured Spicer was trolling the press with that remark.
That’s how I took it.
It had already blown up by then.
Yeah, call it willful ignorance on my part but I still believe that was an epic presidential troll all the way around.
Didn’t they hammer on Palin for the bullseye ad on her website for over a year? Still hang the Gifford shooting on her for that?
This morning Gingrich was clapping his dentures and started on the violent rhetoric and insane levels of vitriol that the left has been using and how it lead to the shooting this morning when the interviewer ( I dont remember who she is) interrupted him and said “This is not the time to talk about that”.
I am not going to sugarcoat it; the left may have more than one standard.
“Didn’t they hammer on Palin for the bullseye ad on her website for over a year? Still hang the Gifford shooting on her for that?”
Yep. Despite the fact that (a) there was also at least one leftist website that also had Gifford in a bullseye and (b) no one ever stopped to ask if Loughner had ever even seen Palin’s website.
Yes, the Left has brought about disturbing levels of violence and the general media has condoned it or ignored it. At the same time, if one side does not deescalate right now, our discourse could become exceptionally disturbing. The Left needs to be more vocal in denouncing the illiberals within their ranks. I’m reading some disturbing responses from mainstream right-wing writers.
It’s disturbing how many times I used the word ‘disturbing’ in that screed. I’m just not good at stuff
Which responses?
Read Instapundit’s re-tweets and Kurt Schilter.
Kurt LastnameIcantspellrightever writes some fun pieces, but he’s openly admitted that he doesn’t give a fuck about ideology or principles anymore and just wants to see the left burn (see his views on Trump getting elected for example). He’s more focused on what he hates than what he supports, which is pretty much the worst response you can have.
Agreed. I never read Kurt. Too hateful for me. If I’m going to read a conservative publication it’s going to be the WSJ editorial page, the Federalist, Hot Air, or the Daily Caller (just for laughs).
The people like Kurt are poisonous.
Looking through the RTs it seems to mirror a lot of the frustration here with double standards and highlighting ghoulish responses from the left. Even here there’s some of the currents of talk about speech influence which is troubling. At least among glibs I’d trust that they can dislike msm tacitly supporting political violence without actually wanting to lock people up for speech. The underlying emotion is probably still there though.
Problem is that you can’t de-escalate if the other side continues to escalate, which seems to be the case now. After the election the left ignored the few sane voices in their ranks telling them what they did wrong and went completely delusional. It’s a matter of degrees of how insane they’ve gone, from just denying basic reality with the ‘Russia hacked the election’ narrative to the full-on antifa violent fantasies of overthrowing mythical Nazis, but more and more seem to be leaning to the more extreme side of that (i.e. the left wing Twitter response to the shootings is truly scummy). You can’t de-escalate against that anymore than you can de-escalate against radical Islamic terrorists, it’s just seen as a weakness to exploit.
So the left keeps pushing and pushing until the right’s sick of it, and then start dropping people out of helicopters. Great.
It’s not a good time, for sure. And the media deserves the bulk of the blame for indulging the Left in their paranoid fantasies.
He misspoke on the 93 million, but this was intentional:
“McAuliffe said “there are too many guns on the street” but then said the issue shouldn’t be raised today.
A reported then remarked, “If it’s not the day for it, why are you bringing it up?”
That’s another goddamn infuriating aspect of the MSM – if you don’t want to be accused of being the PR department of the Democrat Party, stop running cover for them every time they step in it. CBS should not have deleted that quote, and George S. should not have covered for Obama here.
They do the same thing with gun control…with all their issues really. It’s the nature of the left. They lie their asses off and know that you know they are lying. They dont care. They are hoping to dupe the low information crowd, they aren’t interested in engaging with you.
Craven, bald-faced liars.
I often find myself feeling like that guy in V for Vendetta that watches the news and says “Bollocks!”
OT: Could someone with more robust knowledge about the Kansas tax cut / hike situation fill me in or point me to some good info on it? I read a The Hill article about it and the comments made my eyes bleed.
OK, how would you parse this:
“Who would fardels bear,
To grunt and sweat under a weary life,
But that the dread of something after death,
The undiscovered country, from whose bourn
No traveller returns*, puzzles the will…”
*Except Hamlet’s Dad, but let’s not nitpick
This passage seems to suggest that people avoid suicide for fear of what will happen after death.
And don’t forget Hamlet in Act I, Scene 2:
“Oh, that this too, too sullied flesh would melt,
Thaw, and resolve itself into a dew,
Or that the Everlasting had not fixed
His canon ‘gainst self-slaughter!”
We avoid death because we fear it sounds fair but I dont necessarily think that is the only reason.
I dont really fear death, but I do have a lot more stuff to do. I am too busy for dying.
In that case, you are probably a bit less depressed than Hamlet, which is probably a good thing.
Hamlet is like some Goth kid if Goth kids had *real* problems.
Ah, the Jesse Ventura Hamlet “I ain’t got time to die”.
PS – according to these guys, a fardle is a bundle or a burden.
So…who would carry so many depressing burdens in life (“bundle” doesn’t seem to fit) if he could just kill himself, but for the fear of something after death…
The unknown you head off to might be far, far worse then the shit you’re going through now
I think this was Hamlet’s point.
I men, he’d just met his Dad who was visiting from Purgatory:
But that I am forbid
To tell the secrets of my prison house,
I could a tale unfold whose lightest word
Would harrow up thy soul, freeze thy young blood,
Make thy two eyes, like stars, start from their spheres,
Thy knotted and combinèd locks to part
And each particular hair to stand on end,
Like quills upon the fearful porpentine.
But this eternal blazon must not be
To ears of flesh and blood.
-Act I, Scene 5
Again, it’s how you look at it. The burden being the nasty feeling of not avenging his father’s death. You have to carry that around. Later he talks about the quietus which is an accounting term meaning he could settle accounts with the blade (bare bodkin). That’s the choice. A or B. Only 2 choices. Gut it and carry the pain of not avenging (clear to me that is what he means by suffering the slings etc..) or Kill Claudius and hope there is no hell.
The media lies and people die
Progressives were right! Trump would lead to more violence…just they would be the ones getting violent
+1 Goldwater/land war in Asia
I do like how progs who are highly educated and well off have shown their mental illness all thanks to trump.
A big distinction today is the inherent problem stemming from the belief that someone is intelligent and well educated simply because they attended an elite school. These credentialed idiots that sympathize/empathize with and spout marxist drivel are not well educated: they are shallow morons that have glommed to an easy way of playing on the nastiest of emotions that rule some man (envy of what others have and have accomplished). It is high time we push back against the claim they are educated or intellectual simply because they ascribe to the right ideology/dogma, when said dogma/ideology has murdered hundreds of millions and imprisoned billions in misery.
Agreed. I dont think they are actually envious but rather they are control freaks and it bothers them you wont let them control you
Oh, there is a big aspect to this point about control I believe. After all, they believe they are intelligent because they got the credentials and believe (or pretend to believe) the right things, while anyone that objects to them calling the shots obviously is stupid and likely also evil.
They mean well. They are trying to create a society that shields us rubes from the consequences of our choices, and if we don’t submit to the edicts given us based on their wisdom, and do so with vigor, mind you, then we need to be beat into submission for that fault. There is no room for any kind of individuality with these people. Their class is to be the queen bee/ant, and the rest of us should shut up and toil in that wonderful society where words, always pretty ones based on feelings, mean more than any inconvenient reality.
Exactly. It’s easy to regurgitate information presented to you unquestioningly, and even easier to drum up further junk data by throwing together a collection of the modern social justice drivel terms and call it a thesis paper. Read Michelle Obama’s for example, it’s utter crap, or listen to Rachel Maddow and wonder how the fuck she is a Rhodes scholar. But somehow these people are vast intellects that should manage society.
University credentials in the social sciences have become the new aristocratic titles, pay a sufficient amount of money to societal institutions and you get the title of ‘Duke/Doctorate’ and you’re raised up to a level above the filthy peasants.
Buckley had it right when he talked about that Boston phone book versus these people.
Huh. I just heard Bernie Sanders give a strong, full throated condemnation of the shooters actions. Several other Dems too. I half expected a bunch of mush-mouth ‘sorry, not sorry’ kind of bs like Clinton gave us over her supporters rioting in the streets.
Still waiting to hear from the crazier critters. Where is Maxine Waters?
Didn’t she and Lorett Lynch once call for blood on the streets?
I cant remember. I’ll look. She said a lot of really awful shit. Destroying news organizations that have no right to exist? All rights are subject to reasonable restrictions? Going to take executive action on guns? I couldn’t believe the shit she said or how many people were just whistling past the graveyard.
I dont know what happened to her but she appears to have a deep hatred and malicious intent for America and it’s people. I suspect what happened is Bill Clinton. She wanted to be a no-shit, iron fisted dictator and grind the deplorables under her heel IMO. Obama on steroids.
I cant find where Clinton did, but Lynch certainly did call for more blood and death in the streets.
“It has been people, individuals who have banded together, ordinary people who simply saw what needed to be done and came together and supported those ideals who have made the difference. They’ve marched, they’ve bled and yes, some of them died. This is hard. Every good thing is. We have done this before. We can do this again.”
That is from her ‘inspirational’ video that she posted on Facebook. Scary shit.
Creepy Tim also: “Tuesday on MSNBC’s “Morning Joe,” Sen. Tim Kaine (D-VA) said Democrats must “fight in Congress, fight in the courts, fight in the streets, fight online, fight at the ballot box,” against the administration of President Donald Trump.
Yes. That was the Lynch one
Bernie’s a commie sumbitch, but he’s a ‘useful idiot’ communist, not a ‘strongman who starts the gulags’ kind. He backed away from praising Castro when he died too. He comes off more as an idiotic idealist who never worked a real job in his life than the typical control freak sociopaths.
They have the media to actually peddle the nonsense, so they can front. others will do the dirty work.
Don’t worry, Suthen, Maxine will show up eventually to say something so incredibly dumb that it’s even dumber than the last thing she said. She can’t help it. Her and McCain need to be roomies in a nursing home for demented elders.
SugarFree should do a write-up on that.
There is a movie in that, but I am not into old people pr0n…
Does progressivism have a built in kill switch in their movement? Like “the one” in the matrix where they reset
Seems to me they get a little power…go nuts and people get turned off. They double down and go further down the rabbit hole
My grandmother told me that after their last run of power anyone who called themselves a progressive would be lynched in the streets.
Also what is up with john kerry meeting with iranian fm? Does he not understand he isn’t secretary of state anymore?
Some of the bills they sent to Iran got wet while waiting to be unpacked on the tarmac, then the Iranians tried to dry them out but they caught fire…so the Iranians want another money drop.
No, Democrats apparently now never go away now. Do you remember how many times Bush was flying around the world addressing world leaders and making a spectacle of himself after he was no longer POTUS? Neither do I.
They still THINK that they are relevant. Obama jetting all around the world like he’s still president and he won’t even leave DC. I hate these assholes, they need to just get lost.
Yep. Though i think the world leaders ironically respect trump more since it is clear he isnt trying to be a suck up cool kid
A lot of them also hate him with a passion because he doesn’t do that, and thus makes them look bad for doing that sucking up…
Yea didnt mean to say they like trump but rather respect him
Funny how not being a pussy gets even people that might hate your guts to behave, huh?
+1 peanut farmer
I keep using this word – sedition.
I am not fucking kidding.
I cant find where he did that. I do find that it was falsely rumored that Kerry had close family ties to Iranian officials.
I’m sure the Facebook feeds will be full of Dems screaming about the Logan act any minute now.
Not trying to be stuck on one topic all day. But I’ve sorted of been following the leftist media’s coverage of the shooting at the GOP ball practice. They’ve finally admitted that it was political and that the guy was a Bernie supporter. But they are being so calm and collected about it. Like it’s not a big deal. The thing is, can you imagine right now if that had been a Trump supporter shooting Democrat Congressmen? I can’t even imagine the media’s hysterical outrage if that would have happened. But GOP members getting shot? Let’s do some light coverage and move on.
It”s almost like they are demoralized by what happened. Maybe they are secretly wishing there had been a larger body count to validate all that work they did to get this nut job out there doing this stuff?
Yeah, I guess they have to step up the hysteria if they want some real carnage.
I’ve noticed the wapo says injured instead of shot almost like they are trying to take the blame away from the shooter.
Of course they are.
He shot the right kind of people, so he deserves compassion..
“…who will bide his time until he becomes king or of giving Claudius the old Right There Fred.”
‘I’m too sexy for my throne, too sexy for my throne…’
You mean CLAVDIVS. 😉
From what I think is the shooter’s hometown paper:
“James Hodgkinson, the Belleville man accused of shooting at congressmen and aides during practice for a congressional baseball game Wednesday, has written a number of letters to the editor of the Belleville News-Democrat.
“In them, he often railed against Republicans and tax policies, and at least once advocated for legalizing marijuana.
“Following are the letters:
“SEPT. 12, 2012
“The path out of our deficit
“The best book I’ve read in a while is “Aftershock” by Robert B. Reich….
“During the 1920s three Republican presidents lowered tax rates leading up to the Great Depression….
“AUG. 28, 2012
“An idea worth repeating
“Letter writer Roddy Riggs reminds me of Rush Limbaugh and Bill O’Reilly, but I’m sure he doesn’t bring in the millions of dollars those two do. They speak their lies and hatred and misdirection to anyone who will listen….
“…I have never said “life sucks,” only the policies of the Republicans.”
“AUG. 17, 2012
“Income inequality is risky…
“The income inequality was a major cause of the Great Depression…
“I don’t believe all of the messages on Fox News but I still think they get some of it right. Change channels to MSNBC and get a better, balanced opinion….
“JULY 29, 2012
“Trying to buy tax breaks
“One of my favorite TV shows is “The Rachel Maddow Show” on MSNBC….
“JULY 8, 2012
“Obama’s for U.S. workers
“I can’t believe how many people are upset with our president. You’d think that the world was full of rich millionaires. Why else would these people talk badly about a guy who has their best interest at heart?…”
etc.
One of the thing I’ve read today that was interesting today was that he was apparently banned from one of his former workplaces, according to someone who knew him. They weren’t sure why he was banned. People don’t typically just blow up one day and go on a rampage, unless it was with people they know like family or exes, etc., there’s typically signs leading up to it that they might eventually crack up and do something crazy. I’m sure someone saw it coming, like maybe his ex who apparently had not seen the guy for 2 months.
Jeebus, my grammar is horrific today, not sure what’s up with that. Must be that I’m just getting over a bout of the flu. That shit really messed me up.
the Belleville man accused of shooting at congressmen and aides
Jeebus on a pogo stick. That makes it sounds like he didn’t actually shoot anybody.
In statistical terms, he was far more successful in “shooting at them”, than in “shooting them”, so it’s truthful reporting.
Truthy.
meanwhile:
Prof urges students to ‘finish off’ anti-Sharia protesters
http://www.campusreform.org/?ID=9312
***
Syracuse University communications professor Dana Cloud recently issued a veiled call for violence against a conservative group that was holding an anti-Sharia law demonstration.
Boasting that “we almost have the fascists on the run,” Cloud sent a tweet calling for “Syracuse people” to “come down to the federal building to finish them off.”
***
Why am I not surprised this is happening at Syracuse? That communication school was a den of idiots and marxist cunts even back in the late 80s when I was getting my EE masters there. Those communication school types spent all their time partying, protesting, or doing both together. I am telling you that with a few exceptions, practically every school of humanities is a den of evil marxist stupidity.
I think the commies plan on teaming up with radical Islam. I really do.
Kill off the more dangerous but weak and easy prey first, then fight it out amongst themselves?
I think the commies plan on teaming up with radical Islam.
Why not? Radical Islam has a lot of roots in national socialism (mostly around the desirability of killing all the Jews). Sure, the international socialists and the national socialists have their differences, but there’s a lot of common ground, too.
Aren’t they already doing that?
Thank you for posting this. Dana Cloud was a cancer on the UT campus for many years. I did not realize until right now that she was successfully excised and sent off to metastasize in New York. Awesome. Good riddance.
FWIW, the guy who did read-along line-by-line podcast on Hamlet agrees with you, straff. He also has a bone to pick about the “suicide” explanation in pretty much the same terms you did.
Matt Welch just came out with a piece about Sanders’ hypocrisy about political rhetoric and violence.
Before you condemn the violence against Republican baseball players you must also condemn their violent and dangerous rhetoric!
I’d be more favourable towards Reason publishing pieces like that if they didn’t also employ people who use this logic.
You’re probably being sarcastic, but that sounds so much like Reason’s typical style that I could actually believe he really said that.
Not Welch, he’s still pretty consistently good, he remains one of the few writers I can still stand at The Other Site. I’m more pointing out that employing a person who justifies violence over speech at a libertarian publication completely obliterates your credibility on either issue.
Yes and yes
Yeah, I’d agree on both points. Welch is usually good, but there are many others there who aren’t.
Gee, who could you possibly have in mind? *scratching head*
Tulpa?
To be sure, hairstyle counts as much as political consistency.
“Bash the fash!” is in no way a expression of violence towards political opponents, to be sure.
Those aren’t political opponents, they’re untermenschen. Totes diff.
your daily head-desk
Republicans Are Already Blaming the Congressional Baseball Practice Shootings on the Left
Gun control should not be a partisan issue.
By Laura Clawson / DailyKos
June 14, 2017, 9:44 AM GMT
http://www.alternet.org/right-wing/republicans-are-already-blaming-congressional-baseball-practice-shootings-left
***
For the record, we still don’t know anything about the shooter, and whether it turns out to be politically motivated or not and whatever his politics, shooting people is a terrible thing. But whatever you do, don’t politicize it by pointing out that stronger gun laws might possibly have made it harder for the shooter to get a gun. Or to get a gun that could get off so many shots so quickly. Possibly! Sorry for getting all political on you, there—I realize that’s a right reserved for Donald Trump Jr.
***
you stay classy, Alternet
Dear god. The gun made him do it?
Of course it did…
Hey SF, maybe the hair and the hat need a new buddy…
The gun..
SF already has a character with zero impulse control whatsoever.
The writer?
Well, what else? He’s a leftist, and all good leftists know that guns are evil and they should never own one. Unless they’re a cop or politician of course. So it stands to reason that not only did the gun make him do it, but the gun even made him buy it because otherwise he wouldn’t have even owned it! He probably was just innocently walking buy an evil gun store one day and he heard this voice inside his head “Hey, you, come over here. You’re going to buy me and then shoot some people! Mwahaahhaaahaaa!”. Probably the gun was possessed by the spirit of Secret Nazi President and his evil pal, Putin.
Nope, not a leftist – the minute he opened fire, he became a violent right-winger.
Seriously, someone wrote that today.
“Dear god. The gun made him do it?”
I was going to post “The Devil Made Me Do It” by Golden Earring as a response to this, but listening to about 30 seconds of it reminded of why it never became a popular song for them.
I’ll link to this song instead. It has nothing to do with the topic, but it’s a good heavy tune with an insane guitar solo.
Why dont they ever say what laws these might be? Didnt va gov say he had no prior issues?
Because the end game is “ban all guns for private citizens” and that won’t fly. So chip-chip-chip all the time till people give in on a point, then fight like mad to maintain each and every gain.
It worked in every other area of Culture War, so why not keep trying?
Yep, so much this..
Because fuck you, that’s why.
He did have prior issues. I heard a blurb earlier about more than one violent incident in the past and one in particular involving a gun.
This guy was a bomb with a lit fuse.
isn’t that every idiot proggy pawn?
Umm, they’re blaming it on the left because the blame IS on the left. A leftist did it because he bought into the constant hysteria the leftist media, Hollywood, and the DNC and their useful idiots are churning out 24/7.
No no no the gun made him do it!
” we still don’t know anything about the shooter”
We know about his letters to the editor of his local paper, see above.
Hey if we made opiods illegal it might make it harder for people to get their hands on them and OD, just think of all the lives that could be saved!!!!!
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/jun/14/resist-movement-violence-threaten-united-states/
Whether you agree or disagree. This is a frightening piece to read in a mainstream conservative publication. The Left may have pushed too far this time
I know this is going to make me lose points with some the anti-cop people here but a lot of the antifa problem could be solved pretty damn quick with a couple riot squads and mass arrests at the first sign of violence. Places like Berkeley holding back their cops just serves to make the animosity worse.
Eh…..if they’re going to be hyperviolent menaces to the public anyway, at least they could find better targets.
Oh, I think the moment the rocks start flying, there’s every reason to deploy cops with nightsticks.
That isn’t the moment to stop scrutinizing how the cops actually deal with the situation though. There’s a vast difference between tasering, immobilizing and cuffing some guy who is throwing rocks at people in a public place and doing the same to a guy selling loosies on a street corner.
It’s just mind-blowing to me that they’re holding back the cops at this point. Didn’t have a problem crushing the Toronto riots or Occupy with riot squads. But a bunch of middle class untrained college kids dragging fifty year old men into their crowds to beat on him? Better keep those cops back and let the right-wingers defend themselves. The situations I’ve seen where the cops did get involved have actually turned out great: Antifa attacks some random person, cop arrests them, person charges them with assault.
Well, as Suthen notes below, in the case of Berkeley, the cops were directed to stand down.
I’d argue that there would be plenty of justification in launching a federal investigation on some basis or the other. Sounds like an equal rights violation or somesuch. But what do I know? I’m just some limey dissident trapped in a marginally less socialist utopia than I escaped from.
Where are you Number.6?
He’s in the village.
NYC?
I was just asking to set up a suggestion of moving to the south and using all of his money to buy guns.
The people’s republic of Connecticut. So, pretty much NYC.
Fairfield Co., CT. But I work in Midtown NYC.
When Child #2 finishes high school in 3 years, we’re outta here. We’ll become another escapee statistic. Not sure where yet though.
SC, NC, TX – something like that. We’re healthy and employable still.
Yep.
OT – I really need to delete the cookies from my browser, because they keep targeting me with these ads. They’re totally triggering, because I can’r fucking afford it, and won’t be able to for a while.
Wow. That’s beautiful.
That seems a lot for a P bass. for that kind of money i’d probably want something more esoteric, or maybe some vintage J bass or something that would hold/improve its resale value.
Berkley has a commie mayor that named his cat ‘Che’.
He held back the cops specifically so the pinko thugs rioting could use mob violence to intimidate the population. It’s standard commie MO.
I thought that was a parody, but I just checked. It’s true! They’re not even obfuscating by calling themselves “liberals” anymore.
The Cold Civil War
http://www.claremont.org/crb/article/the-cold-civil-war/
They are not going to stop until they cause a civil war or until a bunch of them get themselves killed and then they decide they want a truce. A real socialist utopia like they want can only be brought about by force. Their problem is that most people will not be with them when the violence starts. And I sure as hell do not see them getting the cops or the military on their side. But nothing is going to stop them from escalating this until real violence starts. They’ve already been agitated to the point they’re totally unhinged and the agitators are only upping their rhetoric and calls for violence. I think most people paying attention have know this is coming for years now.
Bad Shakespeare on stilts. I actually had blotted that one out of my memory. The interactions between Hamlet and his ma (Glenn Close) were CREEPY AS ALL GITOUT.
To be sure, shooting those who disagree with you is frowned upon, and quite rightly so. But- those Rethuglikkkinz were begging for it.
In other shooting news
Clearly, California is too lax with their gun laws.
So now UPS people are going postal, too?
They don’t wear those brown shirts for nothing. They’ve joined the Antifa.
Boo.
I can’t wait to see what Marcotte has to say about the shooting.
http://www.salon.com/2017/06/14/lessons-of-the-baseball-shooting-gun-violence-feeds-on-itself-and-even-now-republicans-wont-listen/
***
Lessons of the “baseball shooting”: Gun violence feeds on itself — and even now, Republicans won’t listen
Guns are largely marketed to right-wing male power fantasies, but this latest tragedy shows that no one is immune
…
The left-wing views of the alleged shooter might be surprising to some, but they shouldn’t be. The gun industry and the NRA market guns with promises that owning guns will make the customer feel manly and powerful, and that fantasy has a power that can transcend political boundaries. And no one knows better than gun industry leaders how feelings of political frustration caused by seeing your preferred candidates lose elections can be channeled into a pitch to buy more guns.
Exactly a year ago today, in response to the shooting at Pulse nightclub in Orlando that left 49 people dead, I wrote a piece for Salon that touched on how the gun industry uses political grievances as a hook to convince people to buy more guns. Back then, of course, we had a Democratic president in office. During Barack Obama’s administration, the gun industry was able to move huge numbers of weapons off the shelf by convincing paranoid, resentful white conservatives that the black president was coming to take their guns away.
…
The NRA’s stories about how scary black and brown men are about to bust down your door and kill your family are good for selling guns, but they were the also same narratives that helped propel Trump to the White House. If anything, the fact that a Bernie Sanders supporter apparently went nuts with a gun will increase the paranoia on the right, which in turn will only lead to greater attachment to guns.
Fears of emasculation, racist anxieties about crime, power fantasies about silencing dissent through threats of violence, and a widespread loathing for liberals and their insistence on rational evidence: Those things sell guns. They also get votes out for Republicans. The party cannot give up one without the other. And so we cannot expect that this spate of gun violence, as close to home as this dreadful incident comes for Republican elected lawmakers, will do anything to change their minds.
***
There’s a reason the gun is called “the equalizer”.
“God made man, Col. Colt made men equal”
I thought that was Edward Woodward.
cue Keith Emerson soundtrack
He was the Wicker Man.
NOT THE BEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEES!
What’s that bit about paranoia and people actually wanting to kill you?
“Just because you’re paranoid doesn’t mean they aren’t after you”. It’s from Catch 22,.
I thought it was from Nirvana’s “Territorial Pissings”?
“They’re trying to kill me,” Yossarian told him calmly.
“No one’s trying to kill you,” Clevinger cried.
“Then why are they shooting at me?” Yossarian asked.
“They’re shooting at everyone,” Clevinger answered. “They’re trying to kill everyone.”
“And what difference does that make?”
Fun novel. Underrated movie, imo.
Pivot to gun control. Nice.
I think that Samantha Bee is actually a Russian Spy and NRA member and Putin has put subliminal backwards satanic messages on her show to cause poor innocent liberals to buy scary guns and shoot GOP Congressmen.
Well, that does make as much sense as anything the left is going to say about this. In fact, I think they should go with that, it’s free of charge.
I look forward to seeing Bee doing some soul searching and apologizing for the rhetoric on her show and by apologizing I mean turning this around on Republicans somehow.
The Hillary Apology?
“immune”
that makes no fucking sense. They’re *right wing power fantasies”… but they spread like a disease to the left wing now? which is it? A fantasy, or a disease?
And she has the nerve to talk about “right wing fastasies” while the left literally murders trump in effigy in Shakespeare in the Park.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/12/theater/donald-trump-julius-caesar-public-theater-oskar-eustis.html?_r=0
Right-wing power fantasies are actually cool and even she’s not immune to the charms of being a badass who can fuck shit up?
I mean, it’s more insightful than I’d expect from Our Lady Of Derp (inferior, American version) but….
It’s not even a ‘power fantasy’, it’s power flat out. Yes, you are more powerful if you have a firearm and know how to use it properly. You can completely neutralize the strength difference between a ninety pound woman and a two hundred pound boxer with a gun at a distance. That is not a ‘fantasy’, it’s reality. So if one actually breaks down Marcotte’s idiocy what she’s actually saying is “Guns are sold because they offer power, and are purchased because of a need to acquire it.” No shit Sherlock.
So all those murders in Chicago are committed by NRA card carrying Team Red supporters?
Welch with a pretty good article on that other site talking about Bernie’s hypocrisy when talking about the shooter in Alexandria. https://reason.com/blog/2017/06/14/bernie-sanders-links-political-rhetoric
Welch is the last writer worth reading there. Sullum is obsessed with Russia, even after the narrative has collapsed along with his credibility, and Nick is fucking Nick. The other ones are OK, but screw Robby and Shikha (although, I’ve liked some of her recent stuff).
2 Chili’s still pretty good, and a lot of that has to do with the fact that he doesn’t live in DC and thus has some goddamn perspective outside of the Washington journalist hivemind.
I noticed that Brendan O’Neill also hasn’t had anything published since February, which is telling.
Harsanyi is decent, but they seem to publish him less than they used to as well.
Losing Moynihan and Cavanaugh were major blows.
I can’t figure out what they are trying to be.
FEE makes sense. Cafe Hayek makes sense. Shit, even the Federalist seems to have a consistent brand (even though they kind of suck).
I think they simply killed the brand.
A libertarian bottom rung on the progressive ladder.
Cocktail Party Lite.
Harsanyi’s fine until he gets whiny as fuck about his Jewishness (that article he wrote where he complained that Trump dared to make a statement about the collective horror of the Holocaust rather that just the Jews was so goddamn pathetic).
2Chili is still awesome, although he doesn’t appear all that often.
Shikia is terrible. I don’t… mind Robby, I guess, but I don’t like reading him. ENB is great when she’s writing about things in her wheelhouse (e.g. sex work). CJ Ciamarella is fine as Replacement Balko. Ed K. is probably my favorite writer left there. I can’t stand reading Sullum at this point. Bailey is wearing thing. Nick, is as you say, Nick. Agreed on Welch being worth reading.
if Robby was just a shitty writer who qualified everything with mushy opinions, I would tolerate him. The problem is that the guy is also stunningly ignorant of most of the topics he discusses and clearly doesn’t do any research, but still writes in that shitty, Millennial-lecturing tone where he has all the right ideas.
I rarely disagree (much) with whatever he happens to be saying
but he has some prose-problems. I don’t think he’s written a blog piece without a run-on-paragraph or 2, or sentences that just don’t really begin or end but just start in the middle then stop before they’ve actually said anything.
Its like reading someone who is trying to type while also working as a short order cook. they just blast out their thoughts whenever they have a free second, but frequently have to stop mid-sentence to crack some eggs and flip some burgers, and forget where they left off.
Exactly a year ago today, in response to the shooting at Pulse nightclub in Orlando that left 49 people dead, I wrote a piece for Salon that touched on how the gun industry uses political grievances as a hook to convince people to buy more guns.
Of course, the left would never, ever clamber up atop a pile of bodies to push their agenda. That would be wrong.
I mean, what the everliving fuck is wrong with her brain that she sees “Jihadi kills a bunch of gay people” and thinks “Damn the NRA’s marketing campaign! Damn it to hell!”
It comes down to knowing your audience and giving them what they want.
You know what convinces me to buy more guns? The left.
“Just because you’re paranoid doesn’t mean they aren’t after you”. It’s from Catch 22,.
Pynchon made good use of that in Gravity’s Rainbow, too, as I recall. mmmmmmmmm
The cat helped me write that last comment. She types better than I do.
The cat wants you to spice up your comments, hopefully not in a SF direction.
Where Hamlet is talking of death I am pretty sure he is working through his fear of death and punishment that is preventing him from taking action against Claudius and not musing on suicide.
So when he says…
–“Tis a consummation
Devoutly to be wished. To die, to sleep–
To sleep–perchance to dream: ay, there’s the rub,
For in that sleep of death what dreams may come
When we have shuffled off this mortal coil,
Must give us pause.”–
What he means is “If I knew there was no afterlife I would be free to act on my desires for revenge because the worst that I would have to face was non existance, but what if there is an afterlife and I face punishment for my sins in it? Dare I risk a confrontation with Claudius that may result in my burning in hell for opposing the rightful king?”
And yeah while modern people probably aren’t too worried about the afterlife, certainly not to the extent someone in the 12th century would have, it is fear of punishment that holds most back from acting.
Isn’t it established in Act I that Hamlet is the rightful king, since the Claudius killed his brother?
Not really. The ghost may not be his father. It may be an evil spirit out to deceive him. That’s why he has the players act out his father’s death in front of Claudius. He wants to see his reaction and then have confirmation of his guilt. *Sorry for dead thread f***ing, but the time difference makes it difficult.
It’s been a long time since I last read Hamlet (or watched any version), but I can’t recall ever having any discussion that his soliloquy involved suicide or suicidal thoughts at all.
Might just be the context of the study. I need to dig back into those sooner or later for my own edification.